Skepseis gia to linux

[Φρίξος Κοψαχείλης]

Panayotis Prokopiou wrote:
> Loipon ta parakato einai ena psilo-draft bash tou opoiou aksiologo mia 
> dianomh. Tha ithela na akouso ta sxolia sas. Exei graftei se arketa 
> proxorimenh ora kai den to exo ksanadiabasei apo tote. Thn epiikia sas 
> plz ;-)
> 
> 
> kathe dianomh linux xorizetai se tria merh.
> 
> to core, trivial kai ta extras. Ta oria den einai arketa safh alla o 
> dikos mou diaxorismos einai o ekshs:
> 
> CORE
> kernel, glibc, gcc, binutils, x-windows
> 
> TRIVIAL
> fileutils, findutils, et al
> 
> EXTRAS
> kde, gnome, mozilla, et al
> 
> O tomeas trivial einia ligo poli dedomenos kai den nomizo oti xrizei 
> idiaiterhs analushs mias kai den me endiaferei idiaitera an tha grafo 
> rgrep h' grep -r gia paradeigma.
> 
> Apomenoun loipon oi CORE kai EXTRAS. Kata thn apopsh mou to CORE prepei 
> na einai stathero, na exei oso to dunaton ligotera bugs kai na einai 
> arketa kala dokimasmenos. To poios to dokimazei einai adiaforo (profanos 
> kathenas exei to diko tou metro gia na xaraktirisei kati apodekto pros 
> xrhsh). Allagh stoixeion tou CORE apaitei recompile oloklhrhs ths 
> dianomhs ektos ki an einai apolutos ma apolutos sigouro oti opiodhpote 
> binary prokuptei apo to palio configuration einai to idio me afto pou 
> prokuptei me to neo.
> 
> Theoro aparadekto mia dianomh gia ginetai released kai ta paketa pou 
> periexei na exoun dhmiourgithei sta stadia ths anaptukshs. 
> Xarakthristika to exo dei se mandrake opou upirxan paketa compilarismena 
> akoma kai 5-6 mhnes prin.
> 
> Sta extras periexetai sxedon olh h upoloiph userland. Pano se ena sosto 
> core tha katsei sosta mia sosth efarmogh. Se afto to epipedo to 
> backwards ABI (API?) compatibility einai arketo gia na ginei mia 
> allagh/anabathmish mias efarmoghs h' sunolou efarmogon (px kde).
> 
> To zhtoumeno einai loipon ena stathero core. Sigoura to Fedora einai pio 
> proodeftiko se afto ton tomea apo to Suse kai to Suse pio proodeftiko 
> apo to Debian. To Mandrake to xanei to paixnidi, mias kai exo apotuxei 
> na kano recompile th glibc apo to srpm tou. An den thes na entaxtheis 
> sthn kathgoria Beta-Tester den dialegeis Fedora. Den pistebo oti einai 
> sumptosh oti vgikan taftoxrona ta Fedora Core 3 (to opoio shmeioteon 
> exei perasei ton diko tou kuklo beta testing) kai to RedHat 4 Beta 2 me 
> akribos to idio configuration. Apo thn allh to core tou debian 
> (testing-unstable panta) einai arketa suntiritiko kai oi tupoi pou to 
> sunthroun se psinoun (toulaxiston emena) oti einai oti poio stathero 
> uparxei, xoris malista na thisiazei xarakthristika. To debian omos 
> parousiazei to problhma pou perigrafo pio pano (h userland kai to core 
> anaptusontai parallhla, kai oxi h userland pano sto core -eftuxos oxi se 
> megalo bathmo-). Apomenei to SuSE to opoio an kai dipla sto Fedora 
> fainetai anaxronistiko entoutois einai arketa realistiko (px to fedora 
> exei *-compat paketa gia na trexei mainstream emporikes efarmoges, giati 
> den exei px thn libstdc++ tou gcc 3.3[0])
> 
> Telos an agnohsoume to core afto pou xarakthrizei thn kathe dianomh 
> einai to pos sundiazei ta paketa ths, pos ulopoiei tis ruthmiseis ths 
> kai genika ligo polu ti ginetai mesa sto /etc ths, pou einai enas 
> katalogos opou den apaitountai kainotomies alla panta einai euprosdekth 
> mia sosth domh. To Fedora se afto ton tomea nomizo apotelei to standard, 
> to debian einai miso bhma piso (<flamebait>inetd</flamebate>) eno to 
> suse dinei enan allo aera xrhsimopoiontas ena kentriko arxeio gia 
> ruthmiseis kai ena gui pou energei pano se afto.
> 
> Epeisis nomizo oti oi ruthmoi pou akolouthoun oi dianomes einai polloi 
> grhgoroi pleon kai afto to leo os arnhtiko. Eidika to fedora, mesa se 
> 1-1.5 xrono exei allaksei rizika 3 fores core. To fedora core 2 einai 
> sxedon analogo tou suse 9.2. Mesa stous 6 mhnes zohs tou den evgale oute 
> mia anabathmish gia thn glibc/gcc (nomizo). Kai afto ti shmainei tora? 
> Oti afta ta paketa einai kala dokimasmena kai enas logikos anthropos tha 
> ta eperne kai tha ektize ena gero oikodomima pano tous? H' mhpos mesa se 
> aftous tous 6 eixan to mialo tous sthn epomenh ekdosh kai den tha 
> mathoume pote ti trupes koubalaei to fedora core 2?
>

Gia ayto akrivws to logo yparxei to Debian stable, to opoio einai o,ti 
alarginotero apo bleeding edge, alla einai testarismeno mexri ahdias.

> Diafores parathrhseis:
> 
> 1.To suse upirkse testbed gia to reiserfs, nomizo einai profanes afto 
> thn stigmh pou kaneis den to kserei to suse to exei default.
> 
> 2.Ti shmainei to slackware exei rpm? To oti exei to binary den leei 
> tipota. To rpm to thes gia to depedency system. Epipleon einai akros 
> xazo na bazeis rpm (profanos oxi xtismena gia slackware) sto slackware 
> me opoiodhpote tropo (ektos ki an einai binary only programma).
> 
> 3. Gentoo, kalo xruso, alla otan thes 2 meronuxta gia mia anabathmish 
> routinas kai alla tosa gia na baleis to openoffice... asto kalutera. 
> Pantos einai grhgoro, polu grhgoro kai den ksero giati.

H anavathmisi routinas se o,tidhpote anw tou 1 GHz me anekto poso RAM 
den pairnei panw apo  merikes wres. To prwto sthsimo, mporei na parei 
kai dyo 24wra (cpu time). To openoffice yparxei kai binary, opws ta 
firefox/thunderbird.

> 
> 4. Mandrake, mia megalh omada apo erasitexnes. Parakolouthontas ligo thn 
> cooker mailing list blepeis changelogs ths morfhs "ekana to x giati mou 
> to eipe o y" kai dio revisions pio kato "reverted back to pre-x giati 
> mou to eipe o z". Kai o tupos einai o maintainer tou kde, gia afto kai 
> exei ftasei kapou sto 110 to revision tou kde 3.2.3 kai den exoun balei 
> akoma to 3.3.
> 
> 5. Slackware, h elipsh depedencies einai arketa bolikh me thn proth 
> matia. Mexri gia kapoion logo na thn xreiaasteis. Genika apo ta sobara 
> distros, kai episeis one-man-distro mhn to ksexname!

never failed me for serius work

> 
> Etsi apla kapoies skepseis gia problhmatismo... [1]
> 
> [0] alitheia poso diskolo tha htan h libxyz.so.1-compat na pathsei pano 
> sthn libxyz.so.2?
> [1] ego leo na balo suse pleon kai na to parathso gia arketo kairo. Exo 
> faei polu kairo psaxnontas diafores dianomes kai telika afto pou zhtao 
> apo aftes einai to core tous. Ola ta alla tou koutsobolebo kai monos mou.
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
Mono sto slackware exeis ton APOLYTO elegxo panw sto CORE, akrivws 
epeidh den exei dependency-based package system. Allazeis mono o,ti 
theleis esy :)

Alitheia, to Ubuntu to eides? Looks promising...

-- 
Frixos "I/We/Gaia" Kopsachilis